Right now in the country, you cannot mention the prides of the advertising profession without Verdant Zeal. New but making serious waves, the old hand behind it, Mr. Tunji Olugbodi, is such a good man. The cerebral dresser and soft spoken advertising expert agreed to see the Publisher/Editor-in-Chief of YES INTERNATIONAL! Magazine, AZUH ARINZE, at such a short notice on Monday, October 10, 2011 in his Ikeja GRA, Lagos office. Throwing more light on what his line of business entails, how and when to become your own boss as well as the difference between advertising, public relations and integrated marketing, our session was indeed fruitful and rewarding.
Why must people advertise?
People must advertise because they need to let others know what they have to offer; they need to let people know what is the difference in their own product or service; they need to let people understand that they have something of value that’s perhaps better in material benefit, in cost benefit, in pricing benefit than the next person on the street. So, advertising is dynamic, advertising must always reflect at every point in time what’s there to leverage in terms of comparative advantage.
What makes a good advert man?
By advert man, I take it to mean an advertising person… (Yes!) I think for me it’s always about passion. You must be passionate about advertising, you must be passionate about marketing communication, you must be passionate about being able to bridge the interface between the consumers or the clients on the field and your own direct clients; people who need to make the product or service known in the market place. You need to have a helicopter ability that makes it possible for you to be able to look at things from all perspectives. You must be able to play roles other than what you represent and what you stand for in terms of your profile. I will give you an instance: if I need to advertise for Fanta, the last time I checked, I think it was 14 or 15 years old and yet I must be able to develop communication for somebody who is that age; even as old as I am! I must be able to present things from their perspective in such a way that it will resonate with them. For you to be able to do that, you need a certain flexibility, a certain mature disposition to be able to say this is who I am and what I stand for, but this is what this says. Am I mature enough to be able to process this information and make it credible and to the target? So, an advertising person is somebody…call it an all-rounder. Because again your disposition must be such that you are able to attend to almost any brief. So, in one minute you are talking about selling tyres, the next minute you are talking about selling may be tobacco or you are talking about selling a certain pharmaceutical that has an ethical orientation to it. So, you must be able to wear all those caps and wear them effectively.
What makes a good copy?
A good copy? Hmm! There’s always an age-long argument about that. Some people say a good copy is the one that makes the cash register ring, some people think a good copy is the one that resonates with the public in such a way that there’s a great recall. But I think it’s something in-between the two. And what I mean by that is that when you write copy, it must be something that resonates with your target, but that also is able to persuade them to see your point of view. Resonance does not mean that they enjoy it alone; so, maybe it’s a sing-song and they enjoy to sing the song and yet when it comes to what we call the purchase decision, do they decide to buy that product or service? That’s the critical question, and that’s what advertising basically needs to do. So, yes, there’s the entertainment content of value of advertising, there’s also the call to action value, where they must take the purchase decision in favour of a product or a service. So, a good copy is the one that is able to combine the two. That’s my own thinking, and that can be a very difficult thing to do or to achieve.
What must one do to make it in advertising?
I hate to subscribe to the idea that there’s a straight path, that for you to make it you just do one, two, add this to that and then suddenly you are making it. Because again, that needs to be defined. We all have different high grounds. What is success to me or what connotes making it to me might be different from the other person’s. My own definition of making it is relevance. It’s about value; value proposition. It’s about being able to re-invent the wheel as often as necessary without boring people, without necessarily letting the public suffer what we call audience fatigue. But on broad terms, on a general note, for you to be ranked as being successful would mean that you’ve worked on very major campaigns that have either been landmark campaigns or have been innovative campaigns. Which means you need to have been able to work on several clients’ profiles, different types of clients, for you to be able to draw relevance in terms of experience and perhaps something to show for it. When I say something to show for it again, I don’t mean in material terms. I think something to show for it in terms of track records of the things you’ve done, of campaigns you ran, of clients you’ve worked with, of people that you’ve mentored or that have mentored you. For me, I think that is success.
What do you like most about what you are doing?
I think the diversity, the fact that no two days are the same. I had my plan for today and one hour ago, I had to go out to meet a client at short notice and the meeting was for less than 15 minutes, yet it was very strategic and it’s changing the course of what can happen to even our business in the next two months. So, it’s always being ready for anything. When I talk about diversity in varied nature of the business, it’s also about the fact that you are always called upon based on your pedigree for different kinds of situations and it has a certain cerebral streak to it and that makes that enterprise interesting to me. Because it then means you are always digging and dig deep and say what is the best strategy to address this? I’m one that is given not to quick fixes, so I always look at things more from the strategic medium to long term point of view. So, you don’t fix a problem that is an age-long problem by addressing it in the short term. That’s the way I always see it. So, yeah, what makes it interesting for me is the passion; the diversify. It is the multiplicity of roles, the multi-tasking that you have to do. I think that is interesting to me.
What don’t you like about what you are doing?
The fact that people can take you for granted very easily, the fact that people think when you do this kind of business, there’s not much to it, the fact that, I think for what we do in Nigeria, the entry barrier for this business is too low and I think those are the challenges that we have. And the fact that when you also talk about copyright and intellectual property, there’s virtually no respect for that here. Those are the challenges I think for me every average advertising person is confronted with.
Which of the campaigns handled by you gives you the greatest joy and why?
They are many to be honest with you. I’ve been very lucky. I’ve been very lucky in the sense that a lot of the campaigns I worked on, either in the years past or even since we started Verdant Zeal have either always been ground-breaking campaigns or pioneer accounts, if I can put them that way. So, there are very many that I can point at. Very many! Over the years, one of the ones that gives me a lot of joy was the fact that the agency I used to work for then ran the first major campaign on CNN, apart from one other company in South Africa then, way back in ‘93. And CNN was not a phenomenon around this part then. And we were the first to run that for Crystal Bank. Working on the production of that campaign itself was huge and we had a very huge cast. I remember Tade Ogidan shot the commercial. It was a very huge cast and when it broke on CNN, it was really good. It was a good day for Nigeria then, because there were not many companies doing that at all from around the world. And that I remember very easily. I remember many other accounts that are, like I said, pioneering accounts. Very many. Too many.
Which company would you like to work for but has not been able to?
(Laughs) – Well, the nature of our business is that when we started this, we deliberately said we want to work for clients who fall within category 1– 5 in every major sector. And I think to a large extent, we were able to do that within those sectors. There will still be clients that you know they are either number one or number two or are dominant players that you’ve not had the opportunity to work for. We do not really name clients. I mean, by the nature of our own operations here. So, I will say yes, there are one or two clients that we would love very much to work for, if we have the benefit and the opportunity and we do hope it will come. But what we must understand is that what we’ve done here has been very organic. We’ve basically ran on our own steam and our own experience this far and without any recourse to things like affiliations and partnerships and all of that. So, going into another phase, we do believe that if we do embark on that, then it’s possible that we stand a better chance of working with some of those people who are wholly focused in that kind of thing.
Who is the worst client that you have had to deal with?
Of course, I won’t tell (General laughter). But I don’t have a worst client. What I teach, what I counsel people is that it’s just like how you react when things happen. Now, clients are not given to being bad or being evil. I think it is the way you handle them and the way you react to them. Of course, you do have people who are difficult and people who are impossible, but by your training, you must be able to set parameters. What we agree is that there must be mutual respect, what we call equal seats at the table. If you are not willing to respect what I am bringing to the table, then there’s no basis for us to even relate in the first instance. And people know I hold very strong views about that. I will not even as somebody who is third party expert talk down on third party partners. So, I do not expect somebody to relate with me on a master-servant basis. If you do, then we don’t have a basis to relate. So, for me, I set the parameters. Then, all the other things that may have to do with operational issues or whatever, I think I may address on an on-going basis. But if you then find that in terms of principles, in terms of outlook, in terms of orientation you are not having common grounds, then the best thing is to exit that relationship in a way that is devoid of acrimony. That’s what I teach. But you try to make the best of every client because you have set objectives that are of mutual benefits to both parties. So, I don’t necessarily set out by saying oh, this client is difficult. Of course, there are situations where some clients have been or can be characterized as being all those things or if you are from this stock, then they will be like this. We’ve had from experience that it’s not always like that. It depends on the world view, the orientation, the objectives and so on and so forth from both parties that come to the table.
Why do most agencies find it difficult to pay the media houses they deal with?
I think the first thing is that if agency people understand that agency is agency, agency is agent, they will know that what you earn is actually commission. That’s the first thing. Because I have a feeling that sometimes agency people see everything that comes in as profit. No! That’s where you make a mistake. The second thing is also that you need to understand that it’s partnership. You have an area of expertise, other people have areas of specialization and you bring this together for the benefit of your clients. When you see it that way, then it is easier for you to be able to regulate your relationship with all these people. Now, I’ve given that as a background because it’s not in all situations that the agencies actually set out to default. It’s also part of the reason why I said we need equal seats at the table. There are many situations where agencies themselves are short-changed by clients who do not pay on time. And some of the clients who do not pay on time, sometimes when they have an interest, that makes the agency look bad, because they can now decide to pay a media house directly or on time if they have something doing with them directly, so the agency looks funny. But it also shows how tenuous the agency business can be if you link it to the fact that I said entry barrier is quite low and the fact that there’s no great deal of respectability, even for the profession the way it should be. So, what I always say is this – if you have an agreement, if you have an on-going business relationship with anybody, then you must be able to ensure that it’s a win – win situation for everyone. So, I increasingly advocate that agencies must be able to hold clients accountable to payment periods, that whatever it is they’ve agreed, they must be able to ensure that whatever quality or standard they planned in self respect, they measure up to it. And then by extension whatever it is that is their own obligation to the media houses, they must also meet those obligations. But the situations are not always that easy. There are also situations where human factor comes into play, either on the agency’s side or on the client’s side. There are times you raise invoices and the invoices disappear. By the time you come round to doing a reconciliation, the manager that was in charge had moved on and then it becomes a bit tricky and difficult and all that.
What exactly is the difference between public relations, advertising and integrated marketing? A lot of people confuse the three…
Like I said once, in a manner of speaking, the more everything seems to be bearing different specializations today, the more they still seem to be the same. But the fact that everyone of us that’s in that line of business requires a media platform to be able to accentuate whatever message or messages we need to pass across. For instance, typically, if you work in a media organization, there will always be the editorial department and the advertising or the marketing department. In terms of actual difference, the difference will be that advertising works by persuasion. Whether you persuade people by copy, electronic materials or print materials and so on and so forth. And PR is about, like I said once, demonstrating, rather than persuading. You demonstrate what it is that can happen or should happen as people see the end result and that comes through concrete shared experiences. Integrated marketing is what a lot more people tend to do today. It’s all of it rolled into one in a 360o manner, but with different compartments. So, depending on what the task is, it’s a matter of how do you approach a multi-disciplinary agency. In fact, we call it multi-disciplinary and multi-diversified agency, which means that when we get a brief, we do not necessarily say oh, this brief is advertising, so it must run on radio, TV, press and outdoor. No! We look at the brief and say what is the best strategy to address this. And we’ve had situations where for some clients; it’s their distribution network that needs to be addressed primarily. We’ve had situations where for some clients; it’s their customer service and clients’ facing capabilities that need to be enhanced. So, it’s not that they don’t have a good product, it’s not that they don’t have something that the market is happy about, it’s just that that bomb is created by the fact that people are not tying up the lid properly in terms of the quality of the interface. So, in short, PR is about demonstrating what can be, what should be; advertising is about persuasion and 360o is and integration of all the other ones.
What fond memories of your days at Prima Garnet do you still carry with you?
Every single day, to be honest with you. Like I always say to people, no matter what, for me, PG gave me the opportunity for what I call professional validation. I can never wish that away. You were asking me the other time about accounts that I’ve worked on. Account is about relationship and I’ve discovered that it’s the same passion that you bring to working for someone or somebody else that almost certainly you also bring to doing stuff for yourself. And I think that comes through. So, we’ve had situations where people say the only person that can really solve this problem for us is Tunji, let’s go to him, because he’s done this in the past and that kind of thing. But going to the story of Prima Garnet, it’s very, very fond memories to be honest with you. Very, very! Very, very!! Even up till today.
How about your relationship with Mr. Lolu Akinwunmi, how is it at the moment?
Oh! Wonderful. We still exchanged text messages last week, we still get to talk. I mean, he’s my boss, I’ve worked with him continuously from December 1, 1989 to March 1, 2007. That’s a long time. December 1, 1989, from Promoserve where we met and we worked continuously together up till 1st of March 2007 when I left Prima Garnet. That’s a long time!
Why do partnerships fail in Nigeria?
Let me correct the impression. There was no partnership in Prima Garnet…
(Interruption) – We know. We just thought you should or may have an answer for that.
Okay! I was a part owner, but when you say partnership, I imagine that partnership means that we are starting this business together. No, it was entirely his idea and I need to clarify that. I don’t know, but I would want to think that issues of integrity is very important when you talk about partnership. Oh, we’ve seen people who have been partners for years and years and they have no problems, they have no hang ups. I think the simple thing has to do with issues of orientation and background. You might have worked together for a while or you might have believed in certain things together, but it must be clear that you are able to, when it comes then to a formalized business environment, to carry that too in such a way that it’s seamless. What I mean by that is that there must be trust. If there’s no trust, I think it just basically fails. I think the third thing is what I call the integrity of purpose. I sometimes get the impression that there are situations where people set out to be partners and they know that somewhere along the line they are either going to opt out or they are going to try and do something that will short-circuit the interest of that business, which I don’t think is fair. So, in all said, I think it is good that once you are setting out, you need to understand the parameters. If you are going to be partners for only a while, then let it be spelt out that I just want to be a partner for five years and then we can go ahead and work it out.
When is usually the best time for one to say I now want to be on my own?
For me, I think it works on three levels. One is the power of personal conviction. The day I became convinced, nothing else mattered to me. And when I say nothing else, absolutely nothing else mattered. It didn’t matter whether I was going to be riding a bicycle instead of an official car; it didn’t matter to me whether I was going to be operating from one room instead of whatever, I just knew that it was time for me to go and that was it. Now, the interesting thing about that is that looking back after a few months, many people now started asking me, how come you’ve not been doing this for so long? And to be honest, may be if I did it, I wouldn’t have had the same level of success, if I can put it that way, because it wasn’t based on conviction. For many years, some people had been telling me, you need to go and do your own thing, you need to move on. But I just didn’t find any compelling reason to and the day I found that reason, nothing else mattered. I just wanted to get out and get it done. I think the second way it works is that you must have something to offer. Unfortunately we see today many situations where people operate out of brief cases because everybody wants to become a managing director. Long before I became a managing director, I had met managing directors. So, you don’t have to be called a managing director for you to draw relevance. But you must have something to offer because at the end of the day when it gets to the crunch, it’s what you’ve got within you, it’s what you bring to the table that the people buy. So, there must be something in terms of seed that other people can either invest in or believe in. I think the third thing when you talk about time is also that, if you are somebody that is spiritually led, you will always know. You will always know because many things will work towards that confirmation. Even if they are not obvious. For instance, the year that we started was a very challenging year. It was 2007. It was an election year and I had some people say to me, oh, you know, election year is not good for business, you don’t start a new business in an election year, bla, bla, bla. And I just said well, whether or not, for me, this is the time to do it and we thank God we did it then.
What is the best way to weather the storms in a new business? Or better still, how did you weather your own storms?
For me, number one, I was clear in my mind that we are not going to be doing something that had been done before. What do I mean by this? Where I worked had a good reputation for being a good organization and for doing many things well, if you get what I mean. But I was clear in my mind that there’s no way we are going to be doing another that. It has to be something that is different. Because that is the phenomenon that has come and that has taken its own place. So, it’s important to recognize that. I think the second thing is, for us, we depended a lot on our capabilities. What do I mean by that? Our business is people business, so you have to depend on people aptitude and ability and the interesting thing about it was that when we started, we all came from different backgrounds; we never worked together before. I didn’t leave with anybody from Prima Garnet, so it was like coming together of different minds from different backgrounds. Like the story in the Bible, on the day of the Pentecost, people came from all over and they were all speaking in different tongues. So, they were clearly what was supposed to mean unity of purpose; unity in diversity, if I can put it that way. So, we had people who are willing to bring to the table their capabilities to the benefit of the organization.
What is the best way to get the co-operation of one’s staffers in a new company?
Clarity of the vision, something in it for them; I’m somebody who believes so strongly that everybody must be part owners of whatever business they contribute to. That’s the only way they can see a future. In practice, things don’t always work out that way because we have people who have other interests to pursue, people who have other intentions and all of that. But I do believe that for people who have chosen to build the profession in your line of business, it’s always good for them to at least see a career path, for them to see what the future will be for them.
What is your staff strength and how would you describe the success that you have attained so far?
Well, our staff strength today is right about 55-60. But that’s if you talk about staff that are on ground here, not staff that are on the field, because there are clients that we work for that we also employ different people out on the field, which can come to round about 1900 – 2000 people. In terms of orientation, the orientation we’ve always given ourselves is that if it can be done, it must be done and then excellently well. We run on three legs: on time, on budget and on strategy. For us, what’s made the difference really is that we seem to understand the need – state of the average client today. The average client today is not given to the niceties of long rigmarole or processes and procedures. So, in a manner of speaking, you have to be able to short-circuit or let me re-phrase, you have to be able to shorten the period of process and procedure that enables you to get an answer or a strategy or a response that can be enduring. So, it’s the age of quick service. That’s why we have quick service restaurants. Everything is about convenience and convergence. So, we seem to understand that a great deal and it seems to have worked for us pretty well. And of course also, diversifying your base. We are not one given to the fact that you must always approach things from the traditional advertising point of view or way of doing things or for that matter, pulling from the same source of clients that you all pull from. We believe in growing new markets. It takes a great deal to grow new markets, a great deal of effort, because essentially you are opening up a market or opportunities that other people can come in and have a part to play in. But because it’s worked for us, because it’s a battle that we are always used to…
What is that singular thing that distinguishes Verdant Zeal from the other advertising Agencies?
Just one thing… I will say it’s passion for success. We don’t do things because we just want to do it, we do it because we are committed. There’s been clients we declined working with, because we didn’t think we have any future with them. So, when we believe in something, we commit ourselves into it. Sometimes we commit ourselves in such a way that we don’t sometimes sound as if we are businessmen because businessmen always want to talk about money first. In many instances, we just want to do that thing before we even start talking about money. So, it’s really the passion for success, to get it done and get results.